I am spending too much time on Seabreeze!

Refer to Marks comments about Ezzy RDMs being unbreakable in flat water conditions. I think you can believe it. I am sure they break eventually, but less so than some of the other masts out there.

The other good thing about RDMs in general is that they give you a thick rubber shim that is meant to allow you to use a normal SDM boom on the RDM. In fact they often only warranty the mast if the shim is used. This also means that the mast gets a more even load and it would be difficult to crush it.

Race sails typically use 100% carbon masts for the response characteristics (and weight I think), but carbon is brittle, so they can suffer from knocks.

I have snapped 100% carbon race masts in the sun but I think it is a combination of high loads from huge sails and the heat.

Just buy one of all the masts out there and give us a report in a few months time?...

Carbon won't degrade in sun.. Carbon fibre is just like graphite except its all tangled up and not in sheets.. It will last another 14 billion years of sunlight without changing.. So carbon fibre has the strength of the carbon atoms without the flakeyness that comes with a pure graphite... Carbon fibre turns to graphite at really high temps but you won't get to them in the sun... Its the epoxy that degrades in the sun.. But the outside layer of carbon will stop sunlight reaching the inside layers.. Same reason why black rubber lasts longer than normal rubber..

You cannot damage a mast by over tightening the clamp, its a pretty small lever, and it applies the clamp pressure evenly around the mast..

Gestalt said...

that's it, im using black condoms, not only will i look bigger but i'll last longer

Just don't put it anywhere hot under tension otherwise it might snap in the middle, which will just make things awkward.

KenHo said...

You are over-thinking this.
With your size and weight you are not going to be rough on gear.
Did you stress so much last time (pre-Internet, I'm guessing), or did you just buy a mast and go sailing ?
Bet ya just grabbed one and never gave it a thought.

So B true!! I was much happier when I was ignorant! Still I am getting a bit paranoid having 2 masts break the same way within a few months..same sail & only after I started whinching it down enough to get the leech loose..mmm
I think Ive decided to see if I can afford to get a lipstick 55% carbon 430 + a cheapie 400..after talking to shop maybe using a 430 for short sails with long turbans meant the boom is clamped at a funny height & might have contributed to it....? But then they both broke around the join & thats the reinforced area isnt it..Stuff it just go & make a decision & spend someone elses $
How long did it last ? 15 years ??
Still got it.. the pink one in the photos..but it doesnt fit modern gear..grr[}:)]

barn said...
You cannot damage a mast by over tightening the clamp, its a pretty small lever, and it applies the clamp pressure evenly around the mast..

I gave a green thumb, but this bit isn't strictly correct...

If you tighten the clamp too much, you will crush the mast. You can see this by looking for hair-line fractures running along the mast length, right at the clamp point. Usually these occur under heavy use, but can also occur when closing the clamp if it is too tight (ie: so tight that you cant really close it without brute-forcing it).

That said, those rubber shims mentioned above, pretty much solve this problem. Also, RDM's suffer this problem much less than SDM's, as an RDM (usually) has a thicker wall than an SDM of comparable IMCS.

I've found that a few "newer" style booms have their own skinny adaptors, or a wrap around clamp, these days - None of the supplied boom adaptors or the wrap around clamps are any where near as good as using the rubber adaptor supplied with the Ezzy RDM.
With these "newer" style booms you can not fit the Ezzy RDM using the Ezzy adaptor - they won't physically fit.

Breakage around the join suggests that the 2 mast halves may have separated a bit during rigging, which creates nasty loading points.
I've been happy with my Pryde X6 RDM, which means I've bought it, rigged it, used it and it's still good. Didn't see any broken ones during the Maui week either, that I recall.

sboardcrazy said...

KenHo said...

You are over-thinking this.
With your size and weight you are not going to be rough on gear.
Did you stress so much last time (pre-Internet, I'm guessing), or did you just buy a mast and go sailing ?
Bet ya just grabbed one and never gave it a thought.

So B true!! I was much happier when I was ignorant! Still I am getting a bit paranoid having 2 masts break the same way within a few months..same sail & only after I started whinching it down enough to get the leech loose..mmm
I think Ive decided to see if I can afford to get a lipstick 55% carbon 430 + a cheapie 400..after talking to shop maybe using a 430 for short sails with long turbans meant the boom is clamped at a funny height & might have contributed to it....? But then they both broke around the join & thats the reinforced area isnt it..Stuff it just go & make a decision & spend someone elses $
How long did it last ? 15 years ??
Still got it.. the pink one in the photos..but it doesnt fit modern gear..grr[}:)]

nebbian said...

KenHo said...

Breakage around the join suggests that the 2 mast halves may have separated a bit during rigging, which creates nasty loading points.

+1

Sboardcrazy, are you using tape around the join? This stops the halves separating when putting the sail in, and stops sand getting in.

Yep.. did you see the pretty pics..it broke just below the tape..[}:)] When I saw the luff shape I thought maybe its just pulled apart as I downhauled..?? Nope..grr didnt even get wet.. I suppose it saved a swim.
You can't half tell I've got my Xmas commissions done , I'm bored and theres no wind can you..?

I broke the mast today, second within two months on Shearwater, QLD.
Is is typical week point just below boom? I suspect that must be some connection with my new boom since of all my 4 booms that one broke my two masts none of older any before. I think that problem is that boom connection is too stiff and whole boom works as big lever. Because breakage happen just after water start it wasn't even big load on the sail at the time. First mast broken 430cm and 6.2 sail at 25 knots, next 460 7.0m2 at 22 knots.

Mobydisc said...

sboardcrazy said...

Can you get shims for SDM's? Back in the 90's you used to use them..

Neil Pryde masts come with a plastic shim type sleeve. They are designed for SDM masts. They can be purchased separately too.

Yep I got some mystic ones with my new masts..someone had given me one when I bought their secondhand mast but i didnt think you could use them...durr
ps - Sorry Wooduck..

h20 said...

get the best mast your budget will allow. I recon the 100% RDM mast i have is the best buy i have ever made. Made more difference than when i have changed some of the sails in the past. I hate sailing with my 30% carbon or SDM now.

good masts are much more important than having this year's sail. My 5m is a 2004 but it's rigged on a 100% carbon RDM. I prefer this to a 2010 sail rigged on a 25% mast.

We have managed to break 3 masts in 4 years.
A Tushingham ndm 100% from a big Hooked in stack
A North Platinum Drop shape from a stack
A Challenger ndm 100% sitting in the sun.(White mast pocket)
All masts using Overdrives so they were not hyper bent.
All of them broke 100 to 200 mm below the boom clamp
I think it is the point of maximum load for all masts and dont think "Brand" has anything to do with it. Just buy a new mast and keep on sailing ( a response I got from the wife)

fullmoon said...

We have managed to break 3 masts in 4 years.
A Tushingham ndm 100% from a big Hooked in stack
A North Platinum Drop shape from a stack
A Challenger ndm 100% sitting in the sun.(White mast pocket)
All masts using Overdrives so they were not hyper bent.
All of them broke 100 to 200 mm below the boom clamp
I think it is the point of maximum load for all masts and dont think "Brand" has anything to do with it. Just buy a new mast and keep on sailing ( a response I got from the wife)

Boy I wish my partner had that response!

Gestalt said...

i think brand has everything to do with it.

all of my masts are powerex bar 1 which is a unifiber, i haven't snapped a mast in 6 -7 years. i broke a few prior to the powerex.

just recently i had a very big off that bent my europin uni but still no broken masts.

same with booms, i went through a patch a few years back where i was breaking carbon booms regularly.

my rule of thumb is if i break a piece of kit in conditions i think not deserving of a breakage i don't buy that brand again.

Could a rise in skill have anything to do with that Gesalt?
I figure Powerex ndm's would have aprox the same breakage rate more or less.

Gestalt said...

nah, i'm an average joe on the water.

i don't take any particular care of my gear, i leave it in the sun, never wash it etc.
i weigh 105kg+ so i put a lot of force onto things when i stack it.

over the years i've seen a lot of brands of gear just break for no apparent reason. you just need to vote with your wallet.

not to say stuff doesn't break, cause it does, but there is stuff out there that is very hard to break.

edit,,,, thought i'd add, i don't buy 100% carbon masts. i always go for 60-80% as they take more knocks and don't cost a mint. sails are xply, fins g10 where i can, boards are timber layup, booms carbon that don't have a breakage record.. etc etc.

totally agree with you on this one... not going to mention brands but i think there are different durability amongst them.

I did ask the question recently about 100% being more brittle/ prone to snap??
www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/Windsurfing/General/Loft-Sails-Mast-Compatibility/

where were your comments regarding it then...? (before i purchased another full carbon...i don't want to talk about what happened to it)

I noticed while doing some research some brands don't do 100% in rdm, sailworks and ezzy for example.... could this be for longevity of the mast.

All that said accidental breakages can still occur.