Joint for cold weather?

4 years ago
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Tanel
Tanel
69 posts
69 posts
14 Jan 2022 10:50pm
Hola! Joint time!

Any joint recommendations for cold conditions?

Had a little session today and the GA tendon joint just broke as anything. Wasn't old, wasn't over used and has happened before for the same reason. Water was about 0.5C air near 4C.
45 knots, it took some bashing but nothin unusual.

Would rubber tendon do better?

Used to have Chinook BOGE joints but the metal pin itself broke on that one.
Lost the whole rig. Not going to try it again. I realise most of this stuff probably comes from the same factories but no...

On a positive side, was a nice little session with some swimming in the shore break :D

LeeD
LeeD
3939 posts
3939 posts
15 Jan 2022 1:13am
I've used rubber u joints for over 2000 days in 50-54 f waters around San Francisco and suffered 5 total failures.
Yes, I change them out every 4 years or when they break.
segler
segler
WA
1663 posts
WA, 1663 posts
15 Jan 2022 1:55am
Very close inspection of tendons and bogies will usually show impending failures. When I see tiny cracks, the tendon gets replaced.

Very high stress points are (1) those joints, (2) boom tubes right behind the head fitting, and (3) fin and foil right under the finbox fitting.
Basher
Basher
590 posts
590 posts
15 Jan 2022 4:51am
I personally don't favour tendons, having had a few that failed due to inconsistent manufacture.

But with any U/J a lot of the failure happens because the bearings of your mast extension or deckplate are worn. This means, if the bearings above and below the U/J can't rotate, then the U/J itself gets twisted - and then fails earlier.

So this is something to check.
WillyWind
WillyWind
592 posts
592 posts
15 Jan 2022 9:14am
Are you sure cold weather would accelerate failure? We are not talking about extreme cold or long exposure to low temperatures.
BSN101
BSN101
WA
2390 posts
WA, 2390 posts
15 Jan 2022 10:04am
I've really noticed that the uni takes a massive beating in rough conditions. Much worse than my body!! Check &
double check & replace before failure. $20worth of insurance for a year, simply a no brainer.
Mark _australia
Mark _australia
WA
23647 posts
WA, 23647 posts
15 Jan 2022 1:07pm
Those cheap clear things don't last. Get the genuine chinook or steamlined one.
seanhogan
seanhogan
QLD
3424 posts
QLD, 3424 posts
15 Jan 2022 3:30pm
+1 Streamlined last forever!
Paducah
Paducah
2833 posts
2833 posts
15 Jan 2022 2:16pm
seanhogan said..
+1 Streamlined last forever!


Maybe now but in the old days, those flesh tendons would rot sitting on a shelf (or my case, enclosed trailer). They may have been good but not forever.

I sailed the other day in 4C and my similar GA tendon didn't explode. Of course, I wasn't crashing in 45 kt winds either and lighter than most.
BSN101 said..
I've really noticed that the uni takes a massive beating in rough conditions. Much worse than my body!! Check &
double check & replace before failure. $20worth of insurance for a year, simply a no brainer.



Yes. Tendons are consumables like tires on a car (but cheaper and easier to replace).
PhilUK
PhilUK
1113 posts
1113 posts
15 Jan 2022 5:42pm
Tanel said..
Hola! Joint time!

Any joint recommendations for cold conditions?

Had a little session today and the GA tendon joint just broke as anything. Wasn't old, wasn't over used and has happened before for the same reason. Water was about 0.5C air near 4C.
45 knots, it took some bashing but nothin unusual.

Would rubber tendon do better?

Used to have Chinook BOGE joints but the metal pin itself broke on that one.
Lost the whole rig. Not going to try it again. I realise most of this stuff probably comes from the same factories but no...

On a positive side, was a nice little session with some swimming in the shore break :D



I've no idea about how the cold affects any of them.
The pin breaking on boge type has happened to me, and the last 2 people I helped when theirs failed in the last 2 years. Thats why I dont use them. If the pin breaks the safety rope cant help you, like with your tendon failure it will do. But I dont do much wave sailing, mainly free ride. A tendon is better for that as it gives a more direct feeling. I put up with the harsher feeling on the sea for B&J as I cant be bothered to have 2 types.
I have had just 1 tendon break and the safety rope worked. The place it broke, Kimmeridge, I was around the corner under the cliffs with the possibility of a very dodgy walk back. I replace the tendon each year/100 sessions.

In the end, everything will break, so use whats the best for the type of sailing you do. I dont think there are many slalom sailors who use boge and many wave sailors who use tendons.

PhilUK
PhilUK
1113 posts
1113 posts
15 Jan 2022 6:06pm
On FB, 'Artic Windsurfer' uses tendons. I'll ask him.

www.facebook.com/arcticwindsurfer/videos/393837142506122/
Hanstholm
Hanstholm
72 posts
72 posts
15 Jan 2022 7:37pm
I've good experience with the Goya and also Chinook base and bad experience with the Severne base. The tolerances of the Chinook are quite bad but they work. Severne maybe had some production issues with the lot I used because I killed 3 brand new ones in 1 week. They mostly snapped after Forwards or Backloops. However I change the tendon every autumn no matter if they look good or bad.
LeeD
LeeD
3939 posts
3939 posts
16 Jan 2022 3:41am
Why would anyone use old u joints in the ocean?
I maybe sailed 7
LeeD
LeeD
3939 posts
3939 posts
16 Jan 2022 3:44am
..700 days in the Pacific Ocean, didn't break a joint or base, or pin.
Broke an extension in 4' shorepound and sub 10 wind.
Broke 2 masts in +8' surf.
Tanel
Tanel
69 posts
69 posts
17 Jan 2022 12:36am
Wear and tear and breaking after few years it's all normal. Regular inspection of the gear is part of the routine as well.
But this thing had done maybe 20 sessions. First time in cold and it breaks. By cold I mean not 50F but 32F, 50 I'd consider warm still. But in near zero C the tendon seems noticeable stiffer and that's why I think it broke. And it wasn't the first time one breaking as soon as it's getting cold. In warm climate never had such problem. Anyhow I'll change it and see how long it holds next time. Third for the science!

Broken pin on chinook baseplate happened because there was an air bubble in the metal. That's what they said from Chinook as well, they never said sorry thou :D
LeeD
LeeD
3939 posts
3939 posts
17 Jan 2022 2:37am
I gave up on tendon joints 30 years ago when those flesh colored joints 1st came out.
Succeeding black, gray, yellow, and translucent were worse.
Manuel7
Manuel7
1349 posts
1349 posts
17 Jan 2022 3:31am
Chinook, streamlined (must be fresh and used in non humid climates). Using Bic right now so far so good.
Stay away from the Chinese black tendons!
LeeD
LeeD
3939 posts
3939 posts
17 Jan 2022 4:33am
Manuel7.....
Just got back from 30 days in Eastern Puerto Rico.
Ist 4 days great, but we were jetlagged. Last 6 days were 5.5 and 100 liters with tiny surf at Ceiba.
In between were too many 5-13 mph days.
gorgesailor
gorgesailor
640 posts
640 posts
18 Jan 2022 1:10am
Tanel said..
Wear and tear and breaking after few years it's all normal. Regular inspection of the gear is part of the routine as well.
But this thing had done maybe 20 sessions. First time in cold and it breaks. By cold I mean not 50F but 32F, 50 I'd consider warm still. But in near zero C the tendon seems noticeable stiffer and that's why I think it broke. And it wasn't the first time one breaking as soon as it's getting cold. In warm climate never had such problem. Anyhow I'll change it and see how long it holds next time. Third for the science!

Broken pin on chinook baseplate happened because there was an air bubble in the metal. That's what they said from Chinook as well, they never said sorry thou :D


The Clear ones are injection molded thermoplastic Elastomer may be more prone to affects of cold. The Black Chinook tendons are cast Urethane & are more prone to aging in humid climates but may do better in the cold...
Subsonic
Subsonic
WA
3413 posts
WA, 3413 posts
19 Jan 2022 6:29am
Maybe it was something like this?

leto
leto
284 posts
284 posts
1 Feb 2022 5:25am
Mark _australia said..
Those cheap clear things don't last. Get the genuine chinook or steamlined one.


Second that. I freedive and all clear rubber components such masks, snorkels, fin foot pockets don't last/ get brittle faster than black ones. It has to do with the chemistry/production process of these.
geared4knots
geared4knots
TAS
2649 posts
TAS, 2649 posts
13 Feb 2022 7:47pm
From Hobart/Tasmania , gets cold but not that cold, . well coldest place to windsurf in Australia
never seen a particular higher breakage between summer winter- been in a shop for 20 years.
i use a boge joint, i think they last longer.
Loreni
Loreni
80 posts
80 posts
13 Feb 2022 5:58pm
40 knots at 4 C?
Sandman1221
Sandman1221
2776 posts
2776 posts
14 Feb 2022 10:54pm
Another vote for the Streamlined tendon, have had for 3 years with no sign of cracks, in Florida so no real cold temps, but it is humid year round!
bel29
bel29
413 posts
413 posts
15 Feb 2022 11:38pm
Cold enough? Duotone iBase. No problem.



Tanel
Tanel
69 posts
69 posts
22 Feb 2022 2:10am
bel29 said..
Cold enough? Duotone iBase. No problem.


Indeed my iBase still from North has held up very well too. Haven't tried it in cold but it has got lot of high wind wave sessions over 2 or 3 years can't even remember.
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