I posted this in the kiting forum, but it could have just as easily gone in here

www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=34045#lastpost

Is windsurfing a wind harnessing sport? I would have thought so

Not trying to be confrontational to my south australian cousins, but given the spray I copped, it seems a reasonable question

Sorry - here's my original post. Essentially though, "windharnessing sports" are banned in this area without a permit. Kiters can get permits from AKSA. When I chatted with the council a few months ago, there was no equivalent for other windsports.

If windsurfing is a windharnessing sport, then this guy was not only wrong to be abusive, he was wrong to be out there at all

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I was out at Bower Road, Semaphore, yesterday afternoon. Sweet session on my 9m in 25-28kn seabreeze as recorded by outerharbour windmeter

One windsurfer came a long way out of his way, rode just downwind of me in towards the beach stopping me from turning back out. He then dismounted and let fly with a real spray.

This is the first time in my 5-and-a-bit years of kiting I've ever been on the receiving end of any of the windsurfing-kitesurfing antagonism. I suspect that is because I always try very hard to be as well behaved as possible around windsurfers, because I'm aware of previous issues.

Anyway, he took issue over a few things
1. - That I had no permit (I did)
2. - That I was kiting in a no-kiting area. (I wasn't - I launched south of Bower road, and at no stage was I on land north of Bower road with my kite in the air.
3. - That it was too windy for kiters now, so I should pack up and go home. (I had spent my first hour a little undercooked, and was just getting into the sweet zone for my kite)
4. - because of 3, I was in danger of losing my edge, and taking out windsurfers. (I wasn't, and in fact haven't "lost an edge" in longer than I can remember. May years at least).
5. - He'd been windsurfing in that spot for 20 years, so it was his spot. (No answer to that one I'm afraid, although I suspect that was the real reason he was so upset).

I attempted to have a chat with him about it, and even tried to suggest having a beer together to talk about it, but only scored angst in return.

Soem credit to him. He was clearly a fairly good windsurfer - at least according to my inexpert eye. He looked to be pulling off a few nice jumps etc.

I have thought back over my behaviour, to think whether I had actually done anything deserving of his ire. I spent most of my time 50-100m upwind of the windsurfers. For the first half of my session, there were probably 6 windsurfers out. I would periodically ride a wave down through the windsurfer zone, then quickly kite back up to my normal spot. I gave way to all windsurfers, irrespective of right of way rules.

As it got more congested with more windsurfers, I did this less and less.

I kited very conservatively, never putting my kite in the water. I had only 1 stack all day in which I lost my board, recovered in less than 30 seconds.

Could I have gone further upwind? No. It was low tide, and the wave break was breaking dry. I do this in a higher tide, even though it puts me at risk of hitting the marker poles with my kite (or myself)

Could I have gone downwind? That would have put me well-and-truly into the no- kiting area of the beach.

The guy clearly had an issue with kiters

Anyway. My question is:

Is windsurfing a wind harnessing sport?

If it is, then the windsurfers are not allowed off the beaches all through the semaphore/largs area either. This also includes the area near largs sailing club. The signs all say "no windharnessing sports (including but not restricted to kitesurfing) without a permit"

I'm not attempting to get the windsurfers banned from the beach. But if one of them attempts to incorrectly be the beach-policeman about this issue, I think it is reasonable for me to be able to point out to him that he is in fact in the wrong.

This is the first time I've appeared on the forum in anyway related to a windsurfer-kitesurfer conflict. I normally try very hard to be considerate. I'm just hoping for a bit of the same in return

AFAIK windsurfing is not a windharnessing sport, whatever that is. Windsurfing is primarily a sailing sport. Windsurfing takes up less room than wind kiting and if a wipeout occurs the effects are localised. If the wind is too much for a windsurfer, the worst that can happen is the rig and board will go tumbling, either through the water or through the carpark. If the wind is too strong for a kite, there is much more potential for injury or death.

From what I have seen of kites and it is limited, the reason people have problems with them are fairly obvious.

Firstly, some of the people kiting like to showing off and doing tricks and stuff where there are other people around. This creates danger as kites appear to have a fair bit of power and potential to cause injury or death. You do not sound like that sort of kiter but too many kiters I have seen are fairly inconsiderate and obnoxious.

Secondly kiting takes up a fair bit of room. The lines look like they are over 7 meters long or more. This creates tension where space is limited. Again it sounds like you are aware of this issue and do your best to minimise potential clashes. Sailing downwind of windsurfers would probably minimise tension.

So who knows? Maybe that guy had an argument with his woman and is taking his tension out on you. Perhaps he is a bad natured bastard. Perhaps he is prejusticed against kiters.

Surely 'Windharnessing' applies to any sport that harnesses the wind for propultion? That includes kiting, windsurfing, sailing etc. If the sign was targeted at a specific sub group of windharnessing sports then it would say "no windsurfing" or " no kitesurfing" surely?

At the beach I mainly sail at i'm outnumbered by kiters 8:1 and i've never had a problem. They are all great guys and we're all considerate of each other. There are clowns in both sports that give their respective sport a bad name at times but that's life. Unless kiting is specifically banned in an area then common sense and common courtesy applies I don't think anyone from either sport has the right to claim any sort of superiority.

nifty nev said...



Hi Brady

Sounds like you are a little bit ticked off.
Just to put things in perspective I was one of the 6 or so windsurfers first out yesterday and saw what you were doing.
Yes you did launch south of Bower road but you didn't stay there for long.
Normally windsurfers dont have a problem with kiters after all it is a free ocean isn't it?
And grabbing a few waves is always a good thing, but when you guys fly those things right in the paths of windsurfers who are about to launch themselves it can get a bit hairy.
You said that at no time were you north of Bower road and that the guy came along way out of his way to stop you, well I was standing only 20 feet away on the beach having a well deserved rest in the same area that every wind surfer always launches from. FOR SHAME I think some is telling Porkies.
Saying that you were dead right about 1 thing.
The guy who bailed you up is an excellent sailer, but it's a bit hard to pull of loops
when theres 4 or 5 garrote lines in front of you ready to take your head off is'nt it ?
Any way where were all the other kiters yesterday?
Oh yeah I saw some further up the beach .
Enough said.

Thanks Nifty Nev for the feedback. Hope you had a good session - it was sweet out there. And, yes, I was ticked off. Being yelled at even when trying to have a calm chat about things has a way of doing that. I'm settling a bit now though.

I stated that "I launched south of Bower road, and at no stage was I on land north of Bower road with my kite in the air". This is true. There are no restrictions to being in the water kiting, only to being on land. For that reason, down-winders etc are legit. The closest I came to being on land was when being harangued. To go downwind of the wave break marker, you are obliged to be just north of Bower road. Again, this is not doing anything wrong.

To my knowledge, the only time I affected what any windsurfer was up to while I was sailing was when one guy with a blue sail caught up to me from behind on the way out. When I realised, I accelerated and bore away a bit to give him some space. The other time was when I was retrieving my board the only time I lost it for the day, about 30-50m from shore, inside the wave zone, closer to shore than most of the windsurfers were bothering to come.

All the windsurfer jumps I saw were on the way out. This is the time when I had the potential to be among the windsurfing fleet, as the wave riding bit was very much heading almost dead downwind, and very much attempted only when there was no-one around.

I've gotta say though, I am sort of regretting making this post. The guy himself isn't going to read it, and if he did, it probably wouldn't change his attitude at all. And I certainly don't intend to force all windsurfers to have to get permits or risk being banned etc (for those who don't know, as far as the council is concerned, AKSA membership counts as a permit). Just the fairly arrogant approach from someone who I suspect didn't realise that he might be wrong, towards someone who was trying very hard to actually behave well on the water.

But I would like to say to him, if you're keen for a beer, I'll buy. Much nicer if we can agree to disagree in a civil way. And we might even find we have something in common.

I can't figure out what you've done wrong (cos i don't know the area etc)

but I like your attitude.