Is uphauling ever easier than waterstarting?

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MikeyS
MikeyS
VIC
1509 posts
VIC, 1509 posts
11 Oct 2007 2:46pm
I was out sailing a couple of weeks back in a ripper offshore 25-30kts. There was a guy a fair way off the beach attempting to uphaul a fairly big sail on a floaty board in some steep chop. I'm thinking to myself this don't look to good, so I sailed over to him to make sure he was OK, and even dropped into the water to give him a few waterstarting tips. I was assuming that waterstarting is always much easier than uphauling once you have the technique right, and assuming there's enough wind. He actually managed a waterstart and sailed off fine, but back on the beach he told me that that he was quite tired and found it easier to uphaul. I don't quite get it, particularly since my last uphaul was in 1995. Can somebody enlighten me?
divaldo
divaldo
SA
2878 posts
SA, 2878 posts
11 Oct 2007 2:33pm
What is an uphaul?
stribo
stribo
QLD
1628 posts
QLD, 1628 posts
11 Oct 2007 3:08pm
Mikey i reckon because he had a sail to large for the conditions he was probably getting backwinded every time he attempted to waterstart thus tiring him out.So being on a floaty board and over powered it was probably easier for him to control the sail by uphauling.Although i don't think you would use less energy ,just less goes to get going..
Just my thoughts on the matter...
divaldo
divaldo
SA
2878 posts
SA, 2878 posts
11 Oct 2007 2:53pm
....also maybe he was tired of getting rig flipped an in the right position, falling over etc.....thus wearing himself out?
WINDY MILLER
WINDY MILLER
WA
3183 posts
WA, 3183 posts
11 Oct 2007 1:25pm
seen a couple of wizzards uphauling small waveboards just by holding onto the mast....respect.
frant
frant
VIC
1230 posts
VIC, 1230 posts
11 Oct 2007 3:38pm
MikeyS I think you probably did the guy a favour. I think that waterstarting is easier if you have the correct technique and set up the sail/board orientation to the wind prior to trying to fly the rig. Uphauling can be attempted from any position but does not necessarily mean that you will get underway. It can be pretty tricky to get the transition from holding the uphaul rope to sheeting in, particularly in overpowered conditions. Some helpfull words of encouragement can go a long way to get someone on their way. I had a similar situation a few years back when I resumed windsurfing after a 20 year layoff. I had resorted to trying to uphaul and had fallen off a few times. One of my sons mates sailed over and reminded me that waterstarting was much easier provided you set up correctly and gave me a few tips. Havent even thought about uphauling since.
FormulaNova
FormulaNova
WA
15100 posts
WA, 15100 posts
11 Oct 2007 1:49pm
quote:
Originally posted by MikeyS

I was out sailing a couple of weeks back in a ripper offshore 25-30kts. There was a guy a fair way off the beach attempting to uphaul a fairly big sail on a floaty board in some steep chop. I'm thinking to myself this don't look to good, so I sailed over to him to make sure he was OK, and even dropped into the water to give him a few waterstarting tips. I was assuming that waterstarting is always much easier than uphauling once you have the technique right, and assuming there's enough wind. He actually managed a waterstart and sailed off fine, but back on the beach he told me that that he was quite tired and found it easier to uphaul. I don't quite get it, particularly since my last uphaul was in 1995. Can somebody enlighten me?



Sometimes waterstarting cammed sails in heavy chop can be tiring. Was it cammed? You get the sail just about flying and then the cams pop the other way and you have to start again.

It's at this time that something brushes your leg...

I've had days in the last year where I water start and fly right over the other side of the board and repeat the process a couple of times. Sometimes I just give in and uphaul. That's with 12m sails in 35 knots of course :)
mineral1
mineral1
WA
4564 posts
WA, 4564 posts
11 Oct 2007 2:52pm
Up-haul is way harder than water starts. Particularly if you stuff up, fall in and have too start all over again.
I didn’t know how to water start and spent a whole summer (two seasons back) up hauling because I couldn’t get the water start right.
Spent 15 minutes with Isaac down at Safety Bay one day, and been water starting ever since
The better you fitness the easier it is, but then so is water starting
For those large sails, I use a pool noodle attachment (home made job)on the boom to make it just that bit easier.
jord070
jord070
WA
1109 posts
WA, 1109 posts
11 Oct 2007 4:00pm
i cant uphaul any more unless on a huge board, but i would think uphauling is harder most the time, unless there is only 3 knotts of wind, and you have no chance of water starting
Sailhack
Sailhack
VIC
5000 posts
VIC, 5000 posts
11 Oct 2007 6:07pm
As a recent 'newbie', I found that once you get the technique of a w/start right, it uses less energy than uphauling. I still uphaul sometimes, if I fall 'wrong, and can't be bothered swimming the sail around, or on 'light-wind' days when you either uphaul, or spend 5mins laying in the water until the 'bitey-thing' thoughts enter your head.

Waterstarting also comes in handy if you get a lull, and drop back, ('salt-water enema', I like to call it), hold the position, as soon as a gust comes, you're off!

BTW, I don't do 'waves', I couldn't imagine uphauling if you came off in the waves?
stribo
stribo
QLD
1628 posts
QLD, 1628 posts
11 Oct 2007 7:03pm
I saw a bloke uphauling a go board in lano mainbreak once it was nearly mast high lololololo...What a trooper
puffin
puffin
235 posts
235 posts
11 Oct 2007 8:44pm
quote:
Originally posted by WINDY MILLER

seen a couple of wizzards uphauling small waveboards just by holding onto the mast....respect.



Several years ago a friend of mine asked Robby Naish if he though uphauling could be eliminated from windsurfing, because it's such a pain in the ass. Naish looked at him puzzled, and said "man, I uphaul all the time."

If it's good enough for Robby...
Wet Willy
Wet Willy
TAS
2317 posts
TAS, 2317 posts
12 Oct 2007 2:10pm
Like Robbie, I uphaul all the time...nice to know I'm doing SOMETHING right!
Revhead
Revhead
ACT
372 posts
ACT, 372 posts
12 Oct 2007 1:47pm
Uphauling is much more betterer when the water is freezing!!
shear tip
shear tip
NSW
1125 posts
NSW, 1125 posts
12 Oct 2007 1:53pm
If the sail falls in downwind, quite often I'll uphaul the sail around into a good water start position then I'll jump in and waterstart. It's sometimes faster than swimming the sail around, particularly if the sail has sliced vertically down under water.
FilthyAmatuer
FilthyAmatuer
WA
877 posts
WA, 877 posts
12 Oct 2007 2:35pm
lol, in 2 knots of wind on a massive board i rekon uphauling would be easier... I cant wanter start in much below 10 knots i rekon

Waterstarting is cooler anyway
ChrisPer
ChrisPer
WA
70 posts
WA, 70 posts
14 Oct 2007 4:15pm
I wish you experts were there for me when I was uphauling on my GO at Scarbs last year in 1m+ swells... I gave up and went back to the river.

Seriously, in light wind or as a newbie you have no alternative. I haven't learnt to waterstart yet, and I have tried to get lessons and all.
WINDY MILLER
WINDY MILLER
WA
3183 posts
WA, 3183 posts
14 Oct 2007 5:23pm
if it's to light to waterstart, whats the point.

trust the miller, learn to waterstart, you'll never look back...

spend a whole day perfecting it, easier in waist 2 chest high flat water , maybe back at the river, or crazys/pinaroo with no swell...maybe get a fellow windsurfer to give you a few tips on the water, this will save you a sh!t load of time too.

once you've got it cracked, EVERYTHING else will fall into place and soon you'll toss away ur GO board and you'll be back at scarbs on a sinker doing backies and catching waves
MikeyS
MikeyS
VIC
1509 posts
VIC, 1509 posts
15 Oct 2007 3:19pm
quote:
Originally posted by WINDY MILLER

if it's to light to waterstart, whats the point.




What constitutes "too light to waterstart"? I never rig with an uphaul, but have been caught when the wind drops to stuff all. As long as there's enough wind to fly the sail, I can perform a "leg-over waterstart". I fly the sail and raise the mast to about vertical holding onto the mast about halfway down from the boom with one hand, and grabbing the foot of the sail with the other while I'm still in the water. The I get one leg over the board so the thigh is just behind the mast, and the other leg over so I'm sitting on the board with the mast between my legs, still holding the mast vertical. If there is just enough wind for the board to move, I then start to stand moving my mast hand up the mast toward the boom, then eventually stand up, letting go of the sail foot with my sheet hand and moving it up to grab the boom. It's easier with my 84 litre board than the 74. But it is a waterstart, even if it's only about 5kts.... at which time there sure is no point staying out.
FormulaNova
FormulaNova
WA
15100 posts
WA, 15100 posts
15 Oct 2007 2:55pm
quote:
Originally posted by MikeyS

quote:
Originally posted by WINDY MILLER

if it's to light to waterstart, whats the point.




What constitutes "too light to waterstart"? I never rig with an uphaul, but have been caught when the wind drops to stuff all. As long as there's enough wind to fly the sail, I can perform a "leg-over waterstart". I fly the sail and raise the mast to about vertical holding onto the mast about halfway down from the boom with one hand, and grabbing the foot of the sail with the other while I'm still in the water. The I get one leg over the board so the thigh is just behind the mast, and the other leg over so I'm sitting on the board with the mast between my legs, still holding the mast vertical. If there is just enough wind for the board to move, I then start to stand moving my mast hand up the mast toward the boom, then eventually stand up, letting go of the sail foot with my sheet hand and moving it up to grab the boom. It's easier with my 84 litre board than the 74. But it is a waterstart, even if it's only about 5kts.... at which time there sure is no point staying out.



Ahhh... that'd be when there isn't even enough wind to fly the sail to let you waterstart :) Sometimes it is that light, there just isn't anything to fly the sail and you stand around waiting for the gusts to get you moving at all.

Having said that, I remember sailing a board that was a sinker for me and having the wind die almost completely. I don't have the skill to uphaul when I am standing up to my knees, but I was able to waterstart it and then wobble a few tens of metres at a time.



Sailhack
Sailhack
VIC
5000 posts
VIC, 5000 posts
16 Oct 2007 11:48am
quote:
Originally posted by WINDY MILLER

once you've got it cracked, EVERYTHING else will fall into place and soon you'll toss away ur GO board and you'll be back at scarbs on a sinker doing backies and catching waves



Don't get rid of the GO! I had a ride on one last week on a light-medium wind day, small chop. After wrestling with a 'smaller' board for a few months it was a refreshing change to blast along without having to concentrate on foot position, carrying through to the next patch of wind, etc.
It convinced me to get my big board out on Sunday and had possibly the best session I've ever had, light/medium wind - big board, big fin, big sail. Planing consistantly, some times at a fair speed for over 3 hrs across and back our local bay several times (about 4km run)....arms/legs still ache, but a good ache.

Might have to get on the 'speed' thread now, I think I'm hooked!!!


Waterstart or uphaul, whatever gets you on the board, I reckon!!!
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